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very upsetting news
My patience has officially ended as of today.
In most groups the Admins are in charge, as its there job, but in this group people just do what they want. Most players have stated that there creations are the best, I know Ive done it, but this will end today. Also If the stat systems dont start becoming realistic and everyone gets along I will put this group on lockdown. Other more popular groups make fun of us now because we dont keep on track, and have solid rules. We need a list of rules to put on the homepage, and stick with them after that. If we cant do this then we will postpone any wars untill that point.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 6:28 pm
If you havnt noticed this group is to brainstorm the rules of conflict. ADMINS will decide if the rules are reasonable, not Mods, and there will be no voting, as this group wont ever work that way.
Some highlights of whats been going on recently
(1) mods, are arguing with each other, and me, most members are arguing with each other.

(2) multipe convos appearing that all should be in the same place (CUPS, elipse) Its a big waste of space.

(3) stats are Flawed, since they give to many freedoms to builders. I feel that we should use common sence instead.
weve been seeing multipe problems like artillery having the same range as ICBM launchers, and outdated tanks, having similar stats as cutting edge designes.

We should make it way simpler than it is.
We should only have unit production system, this will work if we all get along. Mineral bonuses are unneccesary.
Maybe you feel that this will never work, since we would fall into Anarchy, I know I would have felt this way two weeks ago, but the I found out about D&L, and C&C. Its a perfect group where everyone gets along, an multiple wars arebeing fought at the same time, this group doesnt compare, thats why they make fun of us.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 6:32 pm
I quit as an Admin, As of now Im shoveling the stress onto Davids doorstep, good luck.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 6:59 pm
 Group moderator 
Woah, Nemisis just demoted himself. I can understand why, his job is probably very frustrating, and I admit I have contributed my share of the problem.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 7:00 pm
Quoting Matthew McCall
Woah, Nemisis just demoted himself. I can understand why, his job is probably very frustrating, and I admit I have contributed my share of the problem.

Its ok, I dont care anymore. After months of argueing with you and other builders Ive given up. keeping the group in check is Davids problem now. If anyone is interested theres a much nicer group called Conquest and Consequence. Its amazing because it works, unlike Conflict, and is way more exiting. Its been two weeks, and I already am all set up, have made freinds, and have had fun. I hope this group gets worked out now that Im done, I havnt really dont much besides create the planet landmasses, and varius little tidbits.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 7:10 pm
 Group moderator 
Well, I'm sticking with this group.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 9:25 pm
 Group admin 
Why not have one person who isn't a player be the overlord of the game? This person could determine what creation has what stats and what is realistic. This person could also be a combat mod since he wouldn't be a player.
Permalink
| December 23, 2011, 10:21 pm
We could just dump the ellipse stat system and let War mods judge with their eyes! That way an old tank can't be better than a modern.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:44 am
I have also thought about these problems. And even was thinking about leaving this group because of the unnessecary, very annoying, chatter.

I think for now we should look at the group of Conquest and Consequence and learn how they do it. That group seems to go very well, even with no super specific rules like here.

I hope we can still make the group alive again, otherwise I'll give it two weeks before I need to leave...


Just some advices: simplify everything
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:50 am
 Group admin 
Quoting John Stahlman
Why not have one person who isn't a player be the overlord of the game? This person could determine what creation has what stats and what is realistic. This person could also be a combat mod since he wouldn't be a player.

I might be able to do that. I've taken a class on aerodynamics & such. Also, which I'm sure you've noticed, I'm not doing much in this group...

That would be a daunting task though, do you know how many creations that are 'backlogged?' I could come up with a general table, but I'm not sure people would be too happy about it. That way, everyone could 'fix' their own.

How's that? Of course, I'm outstandingly fair and balanced, so I could retain my nation (to keep the balance of power that appears to be so delicate) AND write the rules?
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:54 am
Quoting Brickviller -
I think for now we should look at the group of Conquest and Consequence and learn how they do it. That group seems to go very well, even with no super specific rules like here.


Hi everybody! Admin of said group here. Well, Tom is too, but he's really inactive right now, so it all falls to me.

The reason we have a smooth system is because the core players have been doing this since the early days of 2009, just after MOCpages upgraded to the format we have now. Many of those people have moved on now, I myself only showed up in August of that year. But the point is, we've been doing this for years, and we've learned how to streamline it as much as we can.

So, you could follow our system, which has it's weaknesses, or come up with your own.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:37 am
Quoting Ultramarine .
I might be able to do that. I've taken a class on aerodynamics & such. Also, which I'm sure you've noticed, I'm not doing much in this group...

That would be a daunting task though, do you know how many creations that are 'backlogged?' I could come up with a general table, but I'm not sure people would be too happy about it. That way, everyone could 'fix' their own.

How's that? Of course, I'm outstandingly fair and balanced, so I could retain my nation (to keep the balance of power that appears to be so delicate) AND write the rules?

Sounds good to me. Now that Im not an Admin David might need to be a lot more active. Somebody should take charge. Im also wondering where MattP is at the moment.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 11:44 am
 Group moderator 
Quoting Nemesis
Sounds good to me. Now that Im not an Admin David might need to be a lot more active. Somebody should take charge. Im also wondering where MattP is at the moment.

Maybe he's busy, since it's Christmas eve.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 1:05 pm
The more I think about this group, the more I get the feeling it can't be repaired. I had a great time here, but things change. This group was a great idea, but I can't see it working for the next months without mayor modifications to it. Nemesis more or less left the group into the hands of other people. And I lack the will to be into this group that is dying, or even start over with an entire new group.

Anyway, it's not the end of our world, and life goes on. Merry Christmas to all of you!
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 1:07 pm
 Group moderator 
I refuse to give up! I really want to make this group work.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 1:15 pm
Quoting Matthew McCall
I refuse to give up! I really want to make this group work.

I also want this group to work, I probably should have elected a new admin in my place, but forgot. I hope the new Admin does a good job.
I think Ultras Idea will work, and the only part of the old system that should stay in place is the amount of units to make in a week, but much simpler. Maybe get rid of costs, and have a simple chart thats realistic.
maybe the amount fo spaces should also be added instead of expensise.
A country that has under 15 spaces builds 6 tanks a week, while a super power builds 18?
Its much simpler, and if people just accept it, then it will prevent all of this argueing.
Its even simpler that C&C and new members will find it funner, No complicated bonuses, or grueling charts.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:32 pm
Quoting Brickviller -
The more I think about this group, the more I get the feeling it can't be repaired. I had a great time here, but things change. This group was a great idea, but I can't see it working for the next months without mayor modifications to it. Nemesis more or less left the group into the hands of other people. And I lack the will to be into this group that is dying, or even start over with an entire new group.

Anyway, it's not the end of our world, and life goes on. Merry Christmas to all of you!

If we do this correctly then it should be back up in a week or two. Try and stick with us, cause the new sytem should be funner. It will be less complex, and easier.
The only thing that needs to be changed is the stat system, so even if it takes a month to finish you can still continue playing as normal, expanding and talking about your country. It wont be any diferent than it was, only the way wars are fought.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:39 pm
 Group admin 
I was just about ready to leave myself, I was getting sick and tired of this stuff. We had to way over complicate things (my own fault a little) just to make it somewhat work. While I like this group and I think that we can work with it to try to fix things, stuff is just getting way to complicated and unnecessary.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:49 pm
Quoting Brickviller -
The more I think about this group, the more I get the feeling it can't be repaired. I had a great time here, but things change. This group was a great idea, but I can't see it working for the next months without mayor modifications to it. Nemesis more or less left the group into the hands of other people. And I lack the will to be into this group that is dying, or even start over with an entire new group.

Anyway, it's not the end of our world, and life goes on. Merry Christmas to all of you!
Merry christmas, and just because we hit a rough patch doesnt mean the groups dying, it only means a small delay.

Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 2:49 pm
Quoting David Cook
I was just about ready to leave myself, I was getting sick and tired of this stuff. We had to way over complicate things (my own fault a little) just to make it somewhat work. While I like this group and I think that we can work with it to try to fix things, stuff is just getting way to complicated and unnecessary.

Look on the bright side, since we are making a simpler system, it means it will be finished quicker than the last one, so here we go.

All the creations will be made in intervals of weeks.
regular nations (15 to 45 squares)
(Land Vehicles)
infantry 1400 in a week
Tanks 6 in a week
APCs, 8 in a week
Medium armor 10 in a week
(AA, IFVs,)
light armor 18 in a week
(LAVs, transports,)
small Drones 30 in a week
large drones 12 in a week
small artillery 10 in a week
large artillery 7 in a week
Missile launchers 2 in a week

(Aircraft)
fighter jets 5 in a week
bombers 3 in a week
transports 4 in a week
UAVs 12 in a week
helicopters 7 in a week
T helicopters 5 in a week

(ships)
Patrol ships, transports 5 in a week
Destroyers, cruisers, corvets 3 in a week
Subs, Amphibius assualt ships 2 in a week
Carriers 1 in a week

small nations (undre 15 squares) build half, and super poweres are doubled.


Thats all we really need, in a war mods will look at each creation to determin its strengths and weeknesses. Players wont argue.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:02 pm
 Group admin 
Ok. Listen up.

Here I am, the starter of this group, obviously. I am not going to let this group go to s#!t now that we've gotten so far. Really. Just think about it. We started this group from scratch, and we are actually really well known across the pages. We will not give up.


A good idea would be a fresh start. Clean slate. I will make a "Conflict II" group for all who want to continue. We will have rules embedded in stone, where punishments will occur if they are broken. All who help the most at first will be promoted to admin. The new group will have the same premise as this one, but it will be simpler, and more like the group Conquest and Consequence, where you will be free to initiate actions, declare war, and move around the world freely, but on realistic earth time. All the rules will be on the home page. What we need is a fresh start, and if you disagree, you can stay here with the anarchy, and have no fun. Once again, I'm not giving up on this group, and we need to help each other out if one us gets stressed out, like what is happening to a lot of us now. So I will create this new group. And we are going to start fresh.

Merry Christmas Eve and Happy Holidays to all.

Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:07 pm
Quoting Matt P
Ok. Listen up.

Here I am, the starter of this group, obviously. I am not going to let this group go to s#!t now that we've gotten so far. Really. Just think about it. We started this group from scratch, and we are actually really well known across the pages. We will not give up.


A good idea would be a fresh start. Clean slate. I will make a "Conflict II" group for all who want to continue. We will have rules embedded in stone, where punishments will occur if they are broken. All who help the most at first will be promoted to admin. The new group will have the same premise as this one, but it will be simpler, and more like the group Conquest and Consequence, where you will be free to initiate actions, declare war, and move around the world freely, but on realistic earth time. All the rules will be on the home page. What we need is a fresh start, and if you disagree, you can stay here with the anarchy, and have no fun. Once again, I'm not giving up on this group, and we need to help each other out if one us gets stressed out, like what is happening to a lot of us now. So I will create this new group. And we are going to start fresh.

Merry Christmas Eve and Happy Holidays to all.

Sounds great. When will It be up?

Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:09 pm
Quoting Nemesis
Look on the bright side, since we are making a simpler system, it means it will be finished quicker than the last one, so here we go.

All the creations will be made in intervals of weeks.
regular nations (15 to 45 squares)
(Land Vehicles)
infantry 1400 in a week
Tanks 6 in a week
APCs, 8 in a week
Medium armor 10 in a week
(AA, IFVs,)
light armor 18 in a week
(LAVs, transports,)
small Drones 30 in a week
large drones 12 in a week
small artillery 10 in a week
large artillery 7 in a week
Missile launchers 2 in a week

(Aircraft)
fighter jets 5 in a week
bombers 3 in a week
transports 4 in a week
UAVs 12 in a week
helicopters 7 in a week
T helicopters 5 in a week

(ships)
Patrol ships, transports 5 in a week
Destroyers, cruisers, corvets 3 in a week
Subs, Amphibius assualt ships 2 in a week
Carriers 1 in a week

small nations (undre 15 squares) build half, and super poweres are doubled.


Thats all we really need, in a war mods will look at each creation to determin its strengths and weeknesses. Players wont argue.

i would much rather use this style, its not confusing like the others.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:12 pm
 Group admin 
Nemesis, thank you for agreeing with me. This was actually pretty depressing for me when I read this, since we have gotten sooo far. So do you mind helping me set it up. I'll create it right now.

ATTENTION ALL PLAYERS: PLEASE JOIN THE NEW GROUP "CONFLICT II" TODAY. I AM CREATING IT IN A FEW MINUTES.
Thanks,
Matt
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:14 pm
 Group admin 
Also, once everyone has moved to Conflict II,
we will be shutting this group down.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:21 pm
 Group admin 
you forgot satellites, and we need to talk about weaponizing them again. I vote a clear out no on super death ray things, but an orbital launch platform for missiles sounds like a good idea. also spy satellites dont do anything right now, I say that (this was Dr. No's idea btw) during a war, if you have spy satellites up, you can get a sentence or two from the enemies strategy.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 3:55 pm
Yeah I think we'll need to clarify those things again--I think my satellites stealing sentence thing was a good use for them.

On a side note, if we want to discuss new things that will go with Conflict 2 we should do it here, so the new group is not clogged up with junk.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:13 pm
 Group moderator 
I agree with David. No super death Ray satalites, but maybe a small defensive laser, missiles allowed, maybe even kinetic strike rods. Satalites should probably need to be rearmed, because if they run out of ammo, they are out until something refills them.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:21 pm
 Group moderator 
Quoting Dr. No
Yeah I think we'll need to clarify those things again--I think my satellites stealing sentence thing was a good use for them.
On a side note, if we want to discuss new things that will go with Conflict 2 we should do it here, so the new group is not clogged up with junk.

It's a pretty cool idea, but how does a mod decide which sentence to show? Perhaps a player could request to see 1-2 lines of his opponets strategy, like saying lines 4 and 6.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:24 pm
Quoting Matthew McCall
Satalites should probably need to be rearmed, because if they run out of ammo, they are out until something refills them.


Too bad that universal space station was not build--it would have made rearming easier.

--One of the admins should probably put a sentence or two about Conflict II on the main page to make sure everyone sees it.

Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:27 pm
 Group moderator 
Quoting Dr. No

Too bad that universal space station was not build--it would have made rearming easier.

--One of the admins should probably put a sentence or two about Conflict II to make sure everyone sees it.
It is built, they just haven't added it. It's a massive spacestation with a good amount of detail, and it could have been added weeks ago.

Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:29 pm
Quoting Matthew McCall
It's a pretty cool idea, but how does a mod decide which sentence to show? Perhaps a player could request to see 1-2 lines of his opponets strategy, like saying lines 4 and 6.


That would work--like the war mod would say the enemy strategy has say 15 sentences you pick two to spy from--it gives the satellites something to do, in a simple fashion.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:30 pm
The new group should be very similar to avoid confusion. Satalite weapons should only be used if there weak, and can be destroyed easly.
We dont want a nation with satalite weapons becomeing to powerfull for new nations to handle. And there wont be any lasers allowed, it will remain at curret technology. If we dont have functioning lasers on satalites now then we wont use them. Future technology adds to many problems.
Permalink
| December 24, 2011, 4:38 pm
I like the setting for the new conflict,and I would love to join, but the problem is that I stink at building WWII aera things.
Permalink
| December 30, 2011, 3:26 pm
 Group admin 
Quoting ryan rudeseal
I like the setting for the new conflict,and I would love to join, but the problem is that I stink at building WWII aera things.

thats ok, Im setting up a near-future group like this here: http://mocpages.com/group.php/19396
Permalink
| December 30, 2011, 4:22 pm
Group moderators have locked this conversation.
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